Obama’s SOTU Speech Dissected

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Obama State of the Union speechLast Tuesday, President Obama gave his 2015 State of the Union Address. I find it ironic that a man who has worked so hard to bring about division in this country should have the honor of addressing its citizens on the state of the Union.

He’s created more racial division in this country than has existed since before Martin Luther King, Junior’s time; turning blacks and hispanics against whites. As if his race baiting actions weren’t enough, he’s also inflamed class warfare in this, which is supposed to be a classless country. He’s polarized the political parties more than ever before, set the homosexual community to attack Christians and done everything he can to support Radical Islam.

Unity Is Just a Word

Obviously, unity had nothing to do with the speech that Obama gave or anything to do with his agenda. That is, unless unity means submitting to his will. Ever since he came into office, his style of dealing with Congress has been dictatorial. He demands and expects Congress to submit to his demands. Unfortunately for him, there are a few Republicans in Congress who aren’t in agreement with his vision for destroying America.

{adinserter usdeception}Yet, Obama has thrown the gauntlet down at his Republican opponents. Already, he’s threatened to use his pen to veto six separate pieces of legislation that go against his vision for America. That’s going beyond what the veto power of the president is supposed to be for, but since when does that matter to the current occupant of the White House?

A joint FBI & DOJ report about the Ferguson shooting not only proves conclusively that Michael Brown’s civil rights weren’t violated in any way during the shooting that led to his death, but also proves that Obama and his henchmen, Eric Holder and Al Sharpton intentionally used the situation to increase racial tensions in America, as well as tensions between the police and Black Americans.

Obama said that the state of the Union is strong; a statement that has probably been included in every State of the Union Address that has been given since the beginning. But what part is he saying is strong? He’s been dismantling our military. He’s overregulated businesses to the point where they are failing.

He’s raised corporate taxes to the point where corporations are moving their headquarters overseas, just to survive. His only action to help unemployment has been to increase the number of government employees. Where is the strength? If it’s not in our military or our economy, what strength is he bragging about?

Thanks to Obama, America is no longer the world leader she has been since World War II. Now, Europe is looking to Putin for leadership, the head of the very country which we as a nation swore to defend them from. Obama’s actions against Putin’s aggression have been so weak as to be a joke. Putin has seen them for what they are, the empty threats of a weak, ineffective man.

It is clear that Obama doesn’t have an idea of how to lead on a global scale. His foreign policy has been a disaster since day one, and it isn’t getting any better. He refuses to acknowledge the danger of Radical Islam, which he didn’t mention once in his address. According to him, the farce of global warming is a bigger threat. Maybe that’s because in his heart, he’s actually a Muslim.

In a way, Obama’s State of the Union was like his other speeches. He’s never stopped campaigning and this was one more campaign speech. Instead of addressing the country’s problems, he made more promises to those who follow in his wake, with their hands stretched out to receive more government handouts. Between free college and free leave from work, he’s once again offering them other people’s money, so that they’ll vote for him.

How does Obama plan to pay for his new freebies? By creating new taxes. He’s only proposed 442 new tax hikes since he became president, what’s a few more? But you know how he says it; it’s always to charge the top one percent of earners their “fair share” of taxes. I don’t know what the liberal progressive definition of fair is, but the top one percent of earners in the country are already paying more taxes than the bottom 90 percent put together.

The other thing is that they never go after just those top one percent; they go after the middle class. So, while they do increase the taxes on the rich, who can afford it, the ones who always suffer when taxes are raised are the middle class. Our middle class is literally being squeezed out of existence.

In the 30 years between 1971 and 2011, the percentage of American families who are considered middle class have dropped from 61 percent of the population to 51 percent of the population. Since Obama took office, the median family income has dropped by a whopping 8.2 percent; and how does he propose to help it? By charging people more taxes.

So I ask… what’s the State of the Union? Sadly, it’s not good. The big question is whether it can survive two more years of an out of control president who seems hell-bent on destroying it? There’s a lot of hope that Congress will put a stop to him, but Congress is limited in what they can do; especially when the chief executive ignores the legal limits on his power and does what he wants to do.

EMP8

This article has been written by Bill White for Survivopedia.

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Bill White

About Bill White

Bill White is the author of Conquering the Coming Collapse, and a former Army officer, manufacturing engineer and business manager. More recently, he left the business world to work as a cross-cultural missionary on the Mexico border. Bill has been a survivalist since the 1970s, when the nation was in the latter days of the Cold War. He had determined to head into the Colorado Rockies, should Washington ever decide to push the button. While those days have passed, the knowledge Bill gained during that time hasn’t. He now works to educate others on the risks that exist in our society and how to prepare to meet them. You can send Bill a message at editor [at] survivopedia.com.
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Comments

  1. eastofaustin says:

    IMO, we need to raise taxes on everyone. We need to freeze and/or cut governmental spending. We need not to balance the budget, but to create a surplus and have a plan to pay down the deficit. Everybody needs to share in both the pain and glory of recreating this nation. I'm even willing to support a progressive system where the wealthy pay more, but we owe it to all to contribute to the victory that we must have as a nation. Doom and gloomers say that if we raise taxes it will stifle the economy. I believe that if there is a credible plan and commitment to eliminate the national debt, it would jump start the economy. If I believed the dollar was going to be strong into my retirement and what I could pass to my kids, I would stop worrying about the future. I would stop using every spare dollar to purchase "things" that I think will be more useful than inflated dollars. I think that tens of millions of debt-free middle class people would invest, in contrast to withdrawing from the economy. And I'm not talking about abandoning the poor. However, I would no longer "give" them money. I would hire them to cook for one another-- to train them to cook and wash dishes and grow food. I would furnish land and seed and training. Let them eat as much healthy food as they wanted AT NUTRITION CENTERS. No "doggy bags." I'm not infringing on anyone's freedom. They don't have to come, but they would be welcome. I would pay them by the hour (at below the minimum wage) to sit and watch job ads on computer screens. I would pay them to learn to read if they can't (again at below minimum wage). I would pay them to build dormitory like housing with 8x8 rooms with a cot, a desk, a chair and a reading light. I would provide free housing in one of those rooms for anyone who was working, actively looking for work or going to school. I will agree with Mr. Obama's "free community college" for those tooling up or re-tooling for a job-- for those who attended class faithfully, who maintained a B or better average and was on a plan for a certificate or degree that would qualify them for a job that was available in the community. I would provide clothing for all who would improve themselves, but it would be more like a maintenance person's uniform than something stylish. In other words, I would be willing to feed, cloth, and educate anyone in our society, but not on their terms, but on the terms of what the society needs. Once they begin to contribute to society by being a net tax payer, then I would fight for their freedom to do whatever they want. A program like this would stimulate the economy, move towards full employment and provide hope for the future. Furthermore, it is honorable and sustainable. I know that a strong dollar slows exports, but the greatest economic threat we have is a dollar that is weak enough to be abandoned as the world's reserve currency, and that will happen if we don't get our debt under control. That will cripple everyone's savings, pensions, insurance and stocks. Value stored in worthless dollars is non existent. Just my opinion.

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    • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

      Interesting post, Eastof...

      But by your thumbs down responses, it seem like your logic is distasteful to people. The reason for that is that you are describing a 'truthful alternate reality' that actually, much to the denial of most people today, was the basic paradigm of Free Enterprise/Capitalism in an Egalitarian Secular designed society in the Visionary plans set forth by our Founders/Framers that has long since been compromised for agenda based greed and profit by proprietary institutions of seditious power elite.

      'They' have since corrupted the reasonable objectiveness of a fair society based on liberty and justice for all and created new 'rules of law' that benefit the power elite, and not the people. Additionally 'They' have sequestered the hearts and minds, and 'milking' potential of the masses to further their agenda.

      The readers who 'thumbed down' your post probably 'knee-jerked' to your 'raising of taxes' sentence. But they all fail to realize that the power elites have already done that--mainly to "WE, the Sheeple"! While they actually reduce taxes for themselves. The solution was always realized to be something referred to as a universal 'fair tax'. But, obviously it never happened, and it likely never will.

      It gets complicated and lengthy to analyze but for your main concern of the WRC status being lost, don't sweat it too much. As a Holy Person and Prophet, i will predict that this will never happen--at least in the way people believe will cause the dollar to be worthless and collapse.

      If i get the chance i'll do an article on that based on Klipangle's book but briefly it's because that the U.S.A. IS, and still remains by comparison to the rest of the world, too 'big' to fail in the global 'NWO' schema.

      In other words, if we collapse, in any way shape or form, the rest of the world will not be too far behind because of the depth of mutual dependencies. It's a critical synergistic 'small world syndrome'.

      Additionallyl, there's another reason why the government blithely seems to not even care about Reserve Currency being lost? Even if they have a complete 'collapse' of the U.S. Dollar for some reason, That actually helps our Government and country in terms of it debt depending upon how one analyses it. And it wouldn't matter anyway that much for all pragmatic purposes because guess what? There's already a substitute 'Currency' to replace the dollar.

      Can you figure out what it is?

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    • East of Austin sounds like quite a socialist. Building blocks of buildings with 8x8 rooms, giving the residents maintenance workers overalls, making them grow their own food, making them cook for each other as long as they maintain a B average in school? Sounds like the gulags described in the book 'Agenda 21'. Think again 'East of Austin'.

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      • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

        Hmmm, but that's not all it sounds like, Miquel? Sounds like quite a lot of businesses and manufacturing companies that also wear Uniforms, doesn't it? And we already Have the 'gulags' described in Agenda 21 because we already HAVE agenda 21! some call it section 8 housing, some call it ghetto 'project' buildings, etc. etc.

        Vaticanists were the original 'social engineers' for 'socialism' in this country as well as others. More severe social dictatorships like Marx replicated a lot of the same base ideology. I still have a blue monogrammed grammar school 'gulag' uniform shirt i keep to remind me with blood stains on it from my nose that the good father felt necessary to punish for the heinous crime of giggling at one his statements in catechism class.

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        • It's good to know about the truth of those so called 'holy men' in robes all in black like their hearts. They're just part of the scam and control mechanism. At least you survived and have first hand experience of such evil. Never throw that shirt away unless the world becomes free of such insanity and cruelty.

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          • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

            There's an abundance of 'reality truth' in this world that not many have been 'blessed' in revelation thereof.

            When you are gifted of such 'divine enlightenment', you are obligated to pass on the goodness of higher consciousness to others.

            I dutifully keep a few 'reminders' of such epiphany causing experiences in life... for future humanist salvational purposes.

            My Master's thesis had to do with 'religious history' and almost got me 'tossed' from the Catholic University I was attending, LOL!

            My post graduate work is in theological mythology from an epistemology perspective.

            If you'd be interested in 'higher' enlightenment of an 'unpopular' kind, i can recommend a few very 'interesting' books on the 'topic' to get you started on the path to higher consciousness?

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  2. Re: Obama Executive Action

    How do you boil a live frog – by turning up the heat very gradually, until it is too late for the frog to jump off. This feels like Obama’s Immigration policies – first the Dreamers, then Unaccompanied Minors, followed-up deferred deportation for 5 million Illegals in the US for five years or more, and capped off with Homeland Security directives applied to up to 20 million, i.e. all of those have been here since December 2013. And finally the Border Patrol has been directed not to apprehend people who do not have deportable criminal record – how would you know?

    It appears that most of the talking points are created by those who have very little knowledge of the tax law and practices, or how the real world business functions; if not for the purpose of misleading the general public.

    • $20-40 Billion ANNUAL Cost - just for the refundable tax credits (Earned Income Tax and Additional Child Tax Credits) – (married filing jointly with 3 children under 17) no income taxes due, and any withholding would be refunded as Child Tax Credit. Add to this the ‘back taxes’ (for how many years IRS will require and/or allow), and we are talking about some serious money.
    o $15,000 income – no income taxes, but could result in a refund of $7,900 (52%)
    o $25,000 income – refund of $8,600 (35%)
    o $15,000 self-employment – refund of $5,600 (37%) after self-employment taxes – no real proof required

    • Pay Back Taxes – politically expedient slogan without any real enforcement mechanism. Furthermore, there would not be any additional tax collections, just huge amount of REFUNDS

    • Government Expansion – surge in applications (initially funded with the $465.00 fee) will require expansion of the government. However, since the government never shrinks, how are we going to pay for this in subsequent years?

    • Temporary Work Permits – How would you monitor and cancel the Temporary Work Permits and Social Security Numbers – this is anticipated and assumed to become a permanent arrangement – first due to a large number of applications, the deadlines will be extended once, twice and then permanently

    • IRS Rules and Regulations – as with any process, the devil is in the details. The Administration wants to show a large participation (success), thus the rules will be very liberal as to the support documentation resulting in additional REFUNDS, not tax collections

    • Obamacare – if these individuals are indeed exempt from the Obamacare rules, large employers can replace employees with the newly ‘legalized’ ones and save the insurance expenses

    • Other Federal and State Benefits – there will be many as a result of the official Social Security Numbers and Work Permits – as a matter of fact the work permit is just about irrelevant once you have unrestricted Social Security Number

    • Voter Registration is handled by the Counties, very few (if any) of them have resources, tools or a will to check for Citizenship, i.e. if you have a Social Security Number you can register

    Economic Stimulus Argument: This will benefit the economy since the funds are going to be used for consumption (buying cheap Chinese stuff). Yes, and it will also increase the deficit and debt. The National Debt (excluding unfunded liabilities) is only about the same as the GNP (Gross National Product, the size of the economy). So why is this a big deal?

    We don’t pay the debt with GNP, we need tax collections for that, and the debt is 7 times the annual tax collections. Would one be financial responsible of having a continuously adjustable (since 40% is short-term) mortgage of $700,000 with annual gross income of $100,000? What happens when the current artificially low interest rates go back to their historical normals?

    Furthermore, a significant portion of the money does not stay in the US economy – Remittances to Mexico were $22.4 Billion in 2012 – larger than Tourism.

    Just a few thoughts

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    • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

      Good thoughts, Jt. The way you put it kind of creates a profile of a 'corporation' that needs to be shut down for incompetence and 're-organized' after their 'share-holders' Fire all the old 'management' ?!

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  3. Vence Autry says:

    I could not find anything in your comments about the SOTU that I disagreed with. Obama is a traitor. His removal from office would be in the best interest of our national security.

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    • I bet during WWII yo would have called FDR a traitor Then Truman same BS from the nut wing A Republican can do no wrong & a Democrat can do no right.

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  4. It looks to me like BHO is just refusing to acknowledge reality. The question is, will the new Congress, the press, and ultimately The People let him get away with it?
    Based on the last six years, I fear that they will.

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  5. I am still amazed when people talk about Republican /Democrat as if there are really two parties. Seriously? Are you folks living under a rock or in a cave? Are you truly that completely brainwashed? IT IS ONE, AND ONLY ONE, BIG FAT UGLY TOTALITARIAN MONSTER!!! The government wants you to think you have a choice between the two major parties only. Depending on your viewpoint one is good, one is bad. It's the biggest scam ever perpetrated upon the human race. It's time for humans to REALLY wake up and see it for what it truly is. We've all been duped. Just suck it up and open your eyes for just once in your life and SEE IT for what politicians really are. If you think for one second that the term Big Brother is just something from George Orwell's 1984 you are SADLY MISTAKEN!!! Nothing can prepare you for what's coming if the entire world doesn't wake up to that simple truth. The entire world is in a very real dangerous position because of the game the Committee of 300 are playing on humanity...weaving their web of deceit and lies for eventual total world domination. Make no mistake about it. Keep the masses occupied with so much convoluted stories and lies and wars and death and fear and chaos they won't know what's happened until it's too late. We're the frogs in the boiling pot.

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    • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

      I agree, bigmoe. But the political two party system is just one of but not the greatest fraud ever perpetrated upon the sheeple. And most of them would remain in a state pre-programmed brainwashed 'denial' of it even in the light of undeniable proof! And THAT is the biggest handicap to the 'salvation' of our crumbling humanity.

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      • I think Congress and the House should take pay cuts. They are either not there or they sit and read their books or news paper not even paying attention to the person talking. What do they do to deserve
        The pay they get and drive fancy cars, or ride in Limousines. While We who struggle to put food on the table and try to keep our vehicles running hear about the uppers in Government eat lavish food, while the little people have Hamburger, some times with no meat.
        They, the Government People, should clean up the mess they allowed to happen. They have the among them the funds to fix the debt. The President, He gets a great paycheck it would not put any of them in financial distress help out all of you, you that made the mess instead of squeezing the country dry. I really Love my Country, but it really makes me angry to see what the people that are supposed to protect the Constitution have allowed our rights, that our forefathers died to protect, to be taken away from us, God help us, oh I forgot they are taking the name of God out of everything and we are allowing it. IT does not matter what religion you are, your god is mine and mine is your God. Please people take a good look around and get our heads out of muck they they are pulling over us. Remember the Constitution and remember what it stands for. FREEDOM and the Rights that We the people are loosing.

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        • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

          Jane, OF COURSE they should at least take a pay cut! They would be fired in a 'real' corporatist environment in the real world because they are literally dysfunctional and the company 'shareholders' wouldn't stand for it.

          Maybe "We, the People" should think about restructuring the Congressional protocol for more efficiency? Perhaps change it into a meritocratic performance based remuneration system? That'll separate the scammers from the value producers forthwith!

          But first we gotta do term limits to mitigate the corruption potential. Two Terms. One in office...and one in jail if they don't follow the Constitution.

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      • Yeah Mahatma, people would rather believe sweet lies than to accept the harsh truth of reality. There's more to the story, of course, but writing a short novel here wouldn't do much good. You're definitely on the right track. 🙂

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  6. Thankful Nurse says:

    During the Carter administration, the American people, through their taxes, when I was 18 ,helped me with college. I was the daughter of a divorced and struggling mom, and an abusive-then-absent drunk father. We had always been poor, though he was plumber, due to the alcohol.
    I have been a taxpaying, well-paid nurse for several years now, and it is through the generosity and good investment of the American people, in a program that was the called the Basic Education Opportunity Grant---and yes, it was at a community college. My sister, ten years older than I, now teaches Psychiatric Nursing and is a nurse practitioner at a world famous university( I do not want to embarass her by the mention of our father, that is why I'm not saying the name of the school she teaches at. I'm very proud of her.) Her opportunity came through through the Veterans' Administration---her education funding help in exchange for working at the VA hospital during a nursing shortage during the Viet Nam war.
    Things got really "lean-mean" in health care and education, thanks to Reagan and the GOP policies in the following years---the 1980's and 1990's adversely affected health care and its professionals and patients, and really consolidated the Money-crunchers' control over health care, with ICD-9 Codes and Diagnosis Related Groupings--old people were getting kicked out of hospitals too soon, and a whole new layer of expense and complexity in billing was added in the name of "cutting costs". Saint Reagan certainly was the god of "cuts". Sarah Palin described end of life planning as "Death Panels"--what a crock of SH---, everyone knows that the Death Panelists work for insurance companies----I who work in health care can barely pay for insurance, and many years did not have it, and sometimes go without because of huge deductibles---and it is NOT President Obama's fault.

    My sister and I didn't get " a government hand out of other people's money", at the time, it was a gift, it became a loan, we have worked hard paid back several times over. It has lifted us up, and enabled us to help lift up others. Our "government help" wasn't "Communism", it was COMMUNITY!
    A very good investment in COMMUNITY that I will be always grateful for.
    Community colleges are the natural outcome of Ben Franklin's original "free libraries' idea.
    COMMUNITY.
    Isn't that what the "UNITED" States is all about?

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    • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

      Thankful Nurse, good for you! In my world travels I've met a lot of diverse people in various cultures. And the general consensus they mostly agree that America is a generous country by nature. I tell them that their own people would be generous as well if it were not for their totalitarian power elite governments who keep them 'under control' by keeping them dirt poor by mass brain washing and dominance based on fictictious notions like 'Crime Prevention' and 'Public Safety' as the government excuse to violate our innate human rights for their own profit. Then 'THEY' proceed to abuse the 'benevolent nature' of the American personality by greedily acquiring ALL the wealth for themselves at the abusive 'expense' of everybody who is not one of them. I'm not singling out any one group. There are quite a few with replicate agendas.

      People everywhere, in general, are not born bad. But MOST, if not all governments definitely are.

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    • Thankful Nurse - It "worked" for you because you were at the start of the scheme. Have you seen what college costs today? Do you know why college costs what it does today? It's because of all of the debt our government has taken on to throw money at the colleges. I'm sure you might not have taken too many economics courses while you were studying for nursing school, but you (and everyone else that believes the federal government should be providing college money for students) should try to find some time to pick up a book on econ.

      The investment you received was not from "community". There is no community anymore. The community was killed by The Great Society, and all of its handout programs. In a community, people rely on the charity of other community members for help in times of need. This is an important part of community. It is what causes neighbors to be neighborly during good times. Now, in our communities, people literally say "F you" to their neighbors because if a time of need comes, it's not to them that their neighbors that they turn. It is to the people from a far away land that have no idea how well the recipients of the charity behaved during time of need. People that have no idea how hard the "needy" are working to help themselves (if at all). I hope you can see that this type of system destroys community.

      Don't think for a moment that you couldn't have made your way through nursing school without the grant. Would it have been more difficult? Yes. Would it have taken a little more time? Likely yes. Would it have been possible? Yes.

      Now, pretty much the only place where college is affordable is in community colleges. But as soon as the government starts throwing money at them, you'll see their "needs" increase, and the tuitions will increase, and soon, if you weren't getting gov money, you wouldn't be able to afford them either.

      I believe the goal is to get college so expensive that people in the position you were, would not be able to pay for it regardless of the effort they made. And for those that do make it, it will be because they received gov help, or they took on so much readily available loan money that they cannot live after graduating, so they need loan relief programs from the gov. Both make the people dependent on government. When you are dependent, you are no longer free.

      Your views of how things should be, Thankful Nurse, will make slaves out millions. Dependent minions of the federal government.

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      • Tell ya what Walk into any "community" food bank & ask them if their church members donate enough food & cash o serve all those they need to serve & then if they could handle 100 times that. Chances are these churches are full of people like yourself that say poor folks are Not your problem & your not your brother's keeper so then it falls to the government. You hate "handouts" you hate taxes you hate giving the coat off your back for someone in need you refuse to hire but complain about the layabouts. The problem is not the evil gubment but people who would rather pass the buck & then blame everyone but themselves. The biuget problem with the welfare state is not the gubment having one but that it's stuck in the 60's To raw SSI you can't earn more than 70 cents a day. Food stamps (EBT) you cant earn more than $2.00 a day. People can't make it on $7.25 but that makes them too wealthy to be on welfare.

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        • Ike - Many of the repeat food bank visitors are mentally ill. Something needs to be done to care for the mentally ill, and the physically handicapped. Due to a centralization of this population prior to the 80s, I believe it is the responsibility of the country as a whole to care for this population, rather than put that burden onto the "communities" into which they were centralized. This issue is the result of bad government policy, NOT the result of charity being unable to support the unfortunate.

          I most definitely did NOT say that the unfortunate are "not my problem." I said just the opposite. I said it is my responsibility, and the responsibility of others around me to be my brother's keeper. However, the policies now allow people to act independent of a society in times when there is no need, and yet are entitled to "brother" status in times of need. A "community" cannot work that way, and as we have seen, in "communities" where this is attempted, there is rampant drug use, rampant crime, and, as a result, rampant poverty. People with money do not wish to stay in those "communities", so the money flies out. When the money flies out, the stores close up, and service businesses close up. When those businesses close, there is little or no work opportunity.

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        • Ike - If what you mean by "handout" is an entitlement, then I will most readily admit that "I hate handouts". They are destructive to "communities" and therefore destructive to society. Help must be connected with being deserving. You cannot be entitled to help just because you were born into a society. You have to earn help by being a productive, contributing member of a community. There are ways to continue being productive, even as you are on unfortunate times.

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          • Russ Rahn says:

            "People cannot live on [minimum wage]" . - Very true. But no one is tended to live on minimum wage. It is not proper, nor constructive for a society to provide a livable minimum wage. A minimum wage is a wage that someone with no skill or training would earn. Or, it is the wage that someone earns while performing a low skill job that provides a service that cannot be provided at an amount more than the minimum. The first are entry level positions that are to be taken up by young teenagers that for whatever reason have considered this their field for a future. As they work these entry jobs, they live at home. They earn training and skills specific to the business. As older people in the business retire, move, or die, others move into their place, and as steps behind them, the late teen now with a couple of years of experience and training, moves up into a vacated spot that is not paying the minimum.

            As for the services, these jobs are for the elderly that want to make a little extra income, or the second earner within a family, or the teenager earning money for college, or training.

            These jobs cannot be seen by anyone as a career choice. It will stifle the individual, and cheat the community and therefor the society of the true benefit that person has to offer.

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          • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

            Very interesting response, Russ. Everytime i argue that same point, i push some real hot buttons in a lot of people. I also factor in the common sense reality that the 'style' of living in a Free Private Enterprise Capitalistic system winds up being directly proportional to the amount of relative value you can produce and the equation then solves for commensurate skill set/talent/ambition/exprence/ proportional to the remuneration worth.

            Somehow, as you suggested, the reality that the value production cycle of the integrated human participation in social commerce doesn't reach optimum levels when first starting out, just doesn't 'calculate/compjute' in the 'New Math' when people indulge in the pragmatic calculations.

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  7. Just give it away EASTOF AUSTON ! ITS ALL FREE, for who? that is what the problem is now , to many people on the dole, cut taxes on all and not just a little but by many many millions and stop all this BS spending by our Gov. this will create jobs and the people can and will be able to educate, house , feed and cloth themselves. there would then be so many more people paying taxes the debt could be payed off . As far as the people who do not want to work but live off the tax payers ok , for one year, if you are not working by then your cut off, good luck to you . If on the other hand you are willing to work, several jobs if need be you then pay back the tax payer and get to pay taxes yourself. Just my opinion .

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    • eastofaustin says:

      Terry and others,

      I guess my post could be read as a socialist "give it all away" piece. That was not my intent, and if your read closely, that is not what I said "as a whole." What I was trying to say is that we live in a broken system. We live in a doomed to fail welfare state. There were attempts a number of years ago to transform it into a "workfare" state. What I thought would be obvious from my opening lines is that everyone needs to be a net tax payer. All need to contribute to solving the problems at hand. You may have missed the part about not giving people things in cash. My proposition was to provide them a means of getting out of a hole-- to provide food, shelter, clothing and a means of contributing to the society. No one would be forced to take it, but nobody would be getting food stamps, tax "refunds" on taxes they haven't paid, tax money for having babies and watching soap operas. I know that people have made bad decisions at various times. THey may have dropped out of school. They may have a record because they got caught with some pot. They may be "unemployable" in the current political climate. My goal is to make them employable and make them productive in our society. Sending people to school and then turning them loose with a student loan that will take twenty years to repay is crazy, just as it is crazy to assume that most college students have the maturity and wisdom to avoid the credit traps that are laid around them by financial aid officers, banks and credit car companies. I worked my way through my BS, Masters and Doctorate. I had a total of $1000 of student loans when I finished. I also worked 30 to 40 hours a week while I took between a 15 and 22 semester hour load. I'm not trying to toot my own horn, but I am saying that people need to work for what they want. Creating a non-destructive path in which they can work and succeed is to everyone's advantage. The system is broken. If you want to put thumbs down on my outlined solution, fine. What model do you offer? I would be quick to change if someone presented a better alternative. Kill welfare as we know it. Eliminate the word "entitlement" from our societal vocabulary. Reintroduce the idea of "contract" in which both benefits and obligations of citizenship are laid out. Create a path to the future for those who missed the gravy train. Find a way to take the curtains off the window of the gravy train, and help people to see the real struggles of all too many in our society. Socialist? Hardly. But I will never be a Republican or a Democrat again. Under both, personal freedom goes down and the national debt goes up. Seek a better way. (Check out the Libertarian Party as a start.)

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      • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

        "...It is not that most of us don't know anything, it's just that we often don't know any better."--P.J. Klipangle

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      • the Gov. simply giving things to people is what has gotten us to this point, here take this its free , here take this its free, NOTHING IS EVER FREE. Someone has to pay for it, and that is the middle class. which I am at the bottom of now because it keeps shrinking year after year. This has gone on for so many years, generations of families they think thats how it works, there is no American dream for these people,they dont even know what the dream is. In theory I understand what you are saying but who pays for this and what jobs are these people going to get when there done? there are no jobs that are easy ( not hard) that they can get paid 25 30 bucks an hour to do, many are not willing to start at the bottom anymore , I know , I have had to do it several times it sucked . But whats the other option ?

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        • eastofaustin says:

          Terry,

          "The system" as it exists is terrible. It should never have gotten to where we are. And your are right. RAH said it well with the acronym TNSTAAFL. (There's no such thing as a free lunch.) The problem is that any solution that we might try has to begin from where we are. If they made you "Almighty King" for a day, what would you do? Would you kill all the deadwood? You are right when you note that this has gone on for so many generations that they and sometimes we act as if it's normal. The "masses" have demonstrated what happens when they don't get their way. They riot. They burn. They destroy. And there are enough of "them" to tear down the country. What has taken a century to put in place could be gone in a month. That's why so many of us are on this list or lists like it. The idea of "survival" much less thriving in a post apocalyptic world, is highly unlikely for most. As many self defense instructors, including myself, have noted, "The best fight is the one that doesn't happen." Therefore, I refuse to simply give up trying to find ways to save the system. It may be a fool's errand. I can't see what's going to happen. However, I can see many things that might happen, and few things I envision look good. What I truly believe is that the cost of an austerity program empowers the lost to find a way to the future is a whole lot less costly than letting the whole thing come down around our ears. A few years ago, someone was talking about "shovel ready jobs." Someone else noted that very few used shovels any more. In order to do anything in our society-- even to EARN minimum wage-- one must have some communication and math skills. One must know how to punch buttons on a cash register or follow instructions on stocking shelfs. In terms of $25 and $30 dollar an hour jobs, they are everywhere and going wanting. I bet a thousand journeymen electricians, plumbing, AC and heating techs, would be hired tomorrow in San Antonio if they knew what they were doing. Heavy equipment operators are in demand. There are signs for "Help Wanted" all over town, many with "no experience necessary. Starting $10/hr" . SOme offer more. And there is no shame to flipping burgers. I've done it more than once in lean times. (Actually, I guess they were fat times because I saw very little lean meat on those jobs.) But my point is that we have to get from where we are to a place where people can sense a pride in there accomplishment and envision a route from entry level to something better. If we as a society created avenues towards a better future for them, it would cost us less, and bring much higher returns than simply b**ching and moaning about how bad it is. Yes, prepare to take care of yourself and your family, but don't romanticize such a future. As Leonard Cohen sings, "I've seen the future and it's murder."

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      • O I know ,sit in my FREE two bedroom apt at a cozy FREE 80 degrees with all the FREE lights on playing my FREE X box I got by selling some FREE food stamps I did not use to feed my two kids that are in school getting FREE breakfast and FREE lunch. my girl, who is nine months preg. with our third kid who I wont marry because we get more FREE stuff that way, is on the FREE cell phone trying to find a FREE baby sitter to watch her two kids from the last guy she was with so she can go to the store on the FREE bus to get me some FREE 10 dollar a pack smokes and a FREE 12 pack of beer and now look, her disabled X with the fake bad back who lives FREE up stairs just beat me at FREE online tour of duty ! COST just some FREEdoms and some liberty theres and mine.

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  8. P.S will this happen ? not with the type of Gov. we have in place , they want us controlled , and they are doing a good job of it.

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    • eastofaustin says:

      Terry,
      I'm getting tired of your non-sequesters(sp?) You don't engage in conversation. You say the same thing over and over again as if you are not considering anything anyone else says. Your last post describes the current system and rages against it. I agree with you. I haven't seen a post on this list that disagrees with you. THE ISSUE IS WHERE WE MIGHT GO FROM HERE! If you take the stance that there is absolutely nothing we can do about it and wish the whole thing would fall tomorrow, then say so. If that's your stance, I pity you. You must have very little life experience. I don't care how many supplies and skills you have accumulated, you have forgotten something. And even if you haven't, you just aren't aware of how tenuous life was in pre-modern times. Average life spans were about 40 years, and that's because in the age prior to antibiotics, much less 911, stepping on a nail, breaking a leg, a case of the flu or dysentery could easily be a death sentence. One more time: if you don't like my ideas, what are yours? Yes, I suggest "giving" people food, shelter, clothing and education, but not on their terms. If they are not performing on schedule (or at least trying), then my compassion disappears. I know that we can't "save" them all, but if we could get ten to twenty percent of the current dregs into the productive category, I think it would change everything. There is nothing as rabid as an ex-smoker. If we had 20 million people who had climbed out of the poverty cycle with a little help, they would not put up with their counterparts who didn't try. They speak the language of those they have left behind, and they are living examples that prove that it can be done. Those who don't try are a little bit about like those who take the stance that no matter what we do, nothing will change so why try? They don't listen to what's being said to them. They don't respond to what might be possible. They don't want to reflect on and/or discuss ideas. They only want to tell everybody how locked in the current situation is.

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  9. Berta Boop says:

    The state of the union is indeed in a sorry state. For many of US that recognized from the beginning what this potus and his minions were all about, it comes as no surprise. How does one fight against so many delusional voters, easily duped by these Muslim socialists? That is what's happened. These people aren't swayed from their positions even when confronted with evidence and truths. Obama is a liar, anti-American, anti-God unless it's Allah, Socialist, bent on the total destruction of the United States unless someone grows a spine and stops him.

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  10. As far as a monetary system goes, there's no need for federal/state/city taxation. The government can easily assume responsibility for the non-profit production of all our basic needs. Leaving it to private business will only result in corruption, which will then ultimately infect the government/state/local sector...and, not to mention, will create the need for so-called "government oversight" of business practices...and we know this "oversight" is a completely bogus dog-and-pony act, as can clearly be seen today and throughout history.

    If a truly non-profit, citizen-owned/controlled government can assume the duty of producing necessary goods & hiring from the population, no private business could ever compete with them...leaving that business to remain small & family-owned (like they should)...and relegated mostly to eateries, small farms, and artisan-style services. This would result in everyone having the best of technology at their disposal, a cleaner world, VERY low cost of living (because most money from sales go back to the government), far less waste, no taxation of any kind, no corruption, no central bank or federal reserve system, higher standard of living, lower/negative population growth, greater health in all life forms, greater abundance of resources, and so on. It's foolishness to allow private business to become our primary source of food/agriculture, shelter, clothing, raw materials, construction, energy, technology, transportation, and health/medicine. And if you retort with, "I could never trust my government!", then stop FOLLOWING the government and instead BECOME it.

    Interestingly, the former/assassinated dictator of Libya, Gaddafi, established a rule where anyone could have a business, but with the stipulation that they could only hire their own relatives/family members. Certainly a brilliant, yet simple plan to ensure that no business would get too large or corrupt...despite his otherwise insane and often brutal leadership. Americans could adopt a similar policy with great benefit. However, in this country there's no real distinction between government & big business. The corporations are a tool of government (elites). They former does the dirty work for latter...which is why it is futile and senseless to blame or even monitor corporations as if they were some kind of independent entity. They and the government/elites are one and the same. In the old days one could blame the King/Queen/nobility. Today, the nobility has become wiser, having sprouted tentacles into every sector of society.

    Anyway, as long as the human race continues to use a monetary system...ie, the control of resources which has been THE primary tool of enslavement by elites (tribal or otherwise) for millenia...the elimination of private businesses (except for small operations) is the most logical means to a sane world.

    But if you want to take it a step further really apply Logic, as well as accept your true individual sovereignty...then eliminate the monetary system, all government/ruling bodies, and learn to cooperate on a global scale. THAT will be your super-advanced Utopia/paradise, which all of you have been so cleverly conditioned/programmed to believe is impossible, radical, and even "retarded". In reality, the use of money and adoption of a ruling class is THE most retarded and insane concept in existence...and, if you ask me, the greatest & grandest scam there has ever been.

    You want to continue blaming Obama (or other "leaders"/politicians/puppets/yes-men), corporations, the military, government agencies, bureaucrats, rich/famous people, the banking elite, the economy, foreign "enemies", and so on? You want to keep living this life of endless fear & uncertainty? Well, NONE of these things matter. It' the MANY that matter because it's the MANY that give the FEW its power. However, if the MANY don't make their own decisions, the FEW will gladly do so for them. But shouldn't this already be obvious!?

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    • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

      I agree with much of your social analysis even though i'm sure it went 'droning' over many heads. your paradigm is a cross between what the Framers originally envisioned, and something like the 'Venus Project'.

      The historic 'thorn' in the side of good intention and design as always was the constantly changing social dynamics mainly influenced by evolutionary advancement in science and especially technology and the complexity therein.

      The need for 'currency' to replace 'trading/barter' is, indeed, becoming archaic to a soon, to be coming to a theater near you, situation. 'Money' was originally designed as a substitute for labor and other tangible 'things/stuff' of human necessity and desire in their existential life.

      Technology is now replacing some of that necessary exchange paradigm to new concepts of satisfaction...

      And you don't want to hear about what that eventually will mean for us.

      But, you're right about one thing that was well stated. "The many does give the few the power". But it was obtained to massive Fraud and deception and unwarranted control of our liberties with the goal of establishing a 'State of the Union' which will Never allow the people to have any real political power!

      But at the moment we still have a chance to 'take back the power', or at least mitigate the gross inequities through serious changes.

      I sincerely hope we can do that.

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    • eastofaustin says:

      Two thoughts and questions about your analysis:
      First, you speak of the government "producing the goods and services that the society needs." How is this done? It would seem like people produce the goods and services. They may work for/with the government, but unless the whole thing is mechanized, some portion of the people are the producers. Do they get special treatment/a larger share because of their labor, or just the needed portion like everyone else? Who makes the decision as to who gets what? And what happens if they decide that they and their enforcers "need" a larger share? To me, it seems that you are describing the old communist model. Help me see where I am wrong-- the means of production are owned by the State and from everyone according to their abilities and to everyone according to their needs. If all people were good and unselfish, it might work. As Jerry Pournelle once wrote: "If all citizens and officials were good and benevolent towards all, any system of government would work. (paraphrased)"

      Secondly, money is a lubricant in trade. It may be precious metal. It may be seashells. It may be paper. It may be electrons in cyberspace. Anything that people mutually agree is of value functions as money. It might well be a "ration card" that get's punched to keep someone from going through the line a second time. My question is how do you envision trade and/or distribution without some form of keeping score? And if you have a means, how does that differ from money?

      In my earliest post on this thread, I spoke of providing for the needs of those who were trying to do better without giving them cash. I also qualified that as a non-permanent state of affairs. It called for the recipients to "produce" a grade on schedule and move to the role of net producer of goods and services. I recognize that providing Spartan accommodations, food and clothing is treating those in the program like children, and that is far from ideal. My hope is that they don't like it and want to. What that system does is allow no means of accumulating wealth, and nothing to trade outside the system.

      "Money" is a means of "wealth storage." Suppose I am a farmer. Let's say I raise wheat. At harvest time, I have ten thousand bushels of wheat. It all comes in in a two week period. Theoretically, I could store the wheat, and when I need sugar or a plow or a pair of shoes, I could load a wagon with enough wheat to trade for them. However, there would be spoilage and spillage. It is far more efficient to sell the crop and have credits (money) to use throughout the year. Unless there is "money", how can wealth be stored for future usage?

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      • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

        First of all, it would be nice to have some wealth to 'store', LOL! I think most of us don't worry too much about 'storing' it in the same context of first 'accumulating' it? Programmed compulsion to piss it away anyway, not withstanding, LOL!

        Wealthy people don't have any problems with 'storing' their wealth. They just acquire more of it to a point of having enough to burn!

        And to answer your question specifically, of "how can you store wealth without money" I could cop out to saying 'That Depends'. But I won't. Instead I'll do a prophecy.

        "It's all going to change--especially the concept of tangible 'money/currency' in the hands of "We, The Pee-ons' as we know it--in the not too distant future.

        So the current concept of 'wealth storage' will be re-defined in a different paradigm.

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        • eastofaustin says:

          A cop out! Everyone on this list has "wealth." If you have shoes, a shirt, access to a computer, a roof over your head, etc., you have "wealth." You may not have much but you have something of value. If you have the ability to do anything, you have something of value to trade. That is a means to "wealth." "Wealth" is simply a term for stored value. "Money" is simply a means of trading "wealth" apart from direct barter. Direct barter is very complicated because you have to find a person with a particular product and link them with another person who has a different particular product and they must each have a desire for what the other one has. Perhaps there can be three way swaps but it gets more and more complicated as more people get involved. "Money" in some form is required for any and every complex society. I don't argue that any "form of money" is eternal. Today's money may be worthless, but if something else doesn't take it's place, we will be back to the stone age. Money is as old as agriculture.

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          • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

            Well, EOA (is that Austin, Texas by any chance?)
            Thank you for correcting me. There's no higher ascension into enlightenment without first correcting the negative energy of your 'errors' in life.

            I mistakenly thought that the word wealth meant more like the dictionary definition which is 'an abundance of money' ? Not "simply a term for stored value" which can be comparatively diminutive and insignificant and certainly not abundant or great because the notion of general value is so personally subjective. And even the commercial exchange of tangible value is subject to the laws of supply and demand and relative necessity for human existence? And of course not all human 'value' can be physically 'stored' in the form of money.

            I think we got off on a 'value-less' tangent somehow, lol?

            But i disagree with you on simple direct barter/trading being so complicated. It's pretty much refined and to the point by this time in our species development history. You give me something i could use and i give you something you think you could use. Cash/currency is essentially a 'barter/trade' in broader usage acceptance.

            The basic fundamentals of supply and demand set the qualitative and quantitative measurements of barter/trading, or 'value' if you like.

            For instance, in an all out TEOTWAWKI situation most people will give all of their gold stash for the last box of Nutty Bars on the planet if they're hungry enough, right?

            Or if they've already traded all their 'gold' for the now superior 'value' of heavy 'firepower'--because contrary to current capitalistic fraudulent marketing of gold, it will never be worth what you paid for it before a complete economic collapse and maybe very little at all because you can't eat or use it very pragmatically-- they will just 'trade/barter' the bullets in their M-16 for that coveted box of Nutty Bars, if they want it badly enough. Not complicated at all?

            Although I'll try, but somehow i can't bring myself to consider my shoes or computer as 'wealth', even in a minimalist context of figurative vernacular, such as 'less is more', LOL!

            But my bad ass Motorcycle? Priceless!

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      • <>

        Simple…by people working for each other rather than for money. If we’re going to work, then why work long, hard hours for money and get little in return, when we can work very short hours for each other and get everything in return? It would be like EACH person having millions/billions of others working for them. This brings not only freedom from money and the highest standard of living for everyone, but also a HUGE surplus of labor (ie, AVAILABLE labor far exceeds ESSENTIAL labor). Each would work in a field they enjoy/wish to pursue, work far less (and when essential, because the profit motive is absent), and have a substantial amount of free time to do as they please. And with cooperation comes greater & more rapid advancements, as technologies (including ancient & alien technologies) will no longer be suppressed/hidden by powerful profiteers.

        Of course I’ve been speaking here of a money-less society, but you’re talking about a money society. In this latter case, a non-profit government that hires the public & sells goods/services to that same public would still work perfectly. The primary thing such a setup would eliminate, which is the most important thing, is the profit motive…which subsequently removes corruption, waste, mass production, secrecy, taxes, roller coaster economics, poor quality products, the need to import/export, non-essential jobs (which are MANY), and many many more benefits.

        Let's also keep in mind that society doesn't "need" anything. It's people that need & want things. Society is a reflection of the collective, and cannot stand on its own without people. Thus an individual can willfully change despite society…the reason for the elite’s persistent emphasis on conformity (eg, in schools, churches/religion, the military, healthcare system, prisons, news/entertainment media, banking/financial & corporate/commercial sector, legal system, food production, etc.). By keeping the INDIVIDUAL (rather than “the group”) in mind one avoids the risk of losing sight of the BIG picture, or of entertaining and/or inventing non-issues, emotionally charged distractions, and sensationalism.

        <>

        Exactly. People produce the goods/services. But this simple fact is what the pundits, politicians, economists, futurists, cynics/pessimists, know-it-alls, intellectuals & arm-chair researchers, think tanks, and banking/financial elite would like to keep under the rug. Without work/labor, their grandiose words & “visions” mean nothing.

        <>

        I assume you mean some portion would be expected to do some physical/manual labor. Yes, for not all of us have the talent to be engineers, doctors, scientists, etc. But how would even such academically gifted folks obtain all that they need, or hope to ever achieve the modern comforts they desire or envision without the labor of others? Does this not make the laborer equally (if not more) important to the academically gifted? And since we're talking about the academically gifted, we're also talking about the potential for technologies that can greatly lessen or supplant much of the essential labor. But even with 100% mechanized labor, someone still needs to monitor, maintain, and repair the machinery...because, afterall, the machinery exists to serve us. I should also mention that not everyone who is academically gifted will have the desire or interest to pursue a scientific field of work. Some may wish to work more with their hands, such as farming, nursing, operating heavy machinery, construction, etc. Nevertheless, there’s no reason why each person cannot pursue multiple lines of work that interests them.

        <>

        Communism & Capitalism are essentially the same. With each, (1) a monetary system is used, (2) all control/power lies in the hands of an elite few, (3) the system is designed to maintain & expand the power of an elite few, and (4) everyone wants everyone else to work for them (ie, by not working: Capitalists, by being rich/successful, and Communists, by being lazy/refusing to do their share). In essence, both systems are slave systems & extremely destructive.

        They differ only in how they create slaves & how the slaves are treated. Communism is a starker, more brutal, no-frills, in-your-face style of slavery. Everyone knows immediately their place as slaves and fear to speak out in any way. Capitalism is a cleverer & deceptive method of creating slaves. Capitalist slaves either remain mostly unaware that they are slaves, or, for various reasons, accept or don’t care that they are slaves in a system which, on a superficial level, appears “less evil” than other systems. This is achieved by creating the impression that citizens have a “voice”…eg, voting, petitioning, campaigning, “representative government” (Congress/Parliament), “checks & balances” system, the “Constitution” & “Bill of Rights”, “free” press, and for public appeasement, the occasional arrest of notable (but expendable) white collar criminals, etc. Mind-altering & programming techniques are also employed by the use of distractions & pleasures…such as junk entertainment, endless gossip, sports, endless shopping, gambling, recreational/medical drugs, fear- & issue-mongering, news & political propaganda, staged public events & false flag operations, military victories & patriotic veteran sob stories, etc. And today’s tech allows the elite to take this manipulation to the next level…with cable TV, video games, social media, media attacks on outspoken “radicals”, mind control projects & programming (eg, psychiatry, MK-ULTRA), assassinations, music/entertainment industry, psychiatric/medical drugs, junk food & artificial additives, GMO’s, vaccines, chemtrails, environmental destruction & contamination, etc. Unlike Communist slaves, Capitalist slaves are kept fatter on junk food, better entertained, and more encouraged to consume. In fact, the Western/Capitalist system comes with an added bonus that outright Communism & overt despotism lacks: Westerners, intoxicated by consumerism & national pride, are far more prone to become self-policing. There will always be other citizens, under the spell of “the group”, that will rebut your views no matter how sound your logic may be. Hence, and by design, inconsequential is the impact to the elite if angry citizens denounce the President (a puppet), politicians, or even the elites themselves. As long as the finger of blame is being pointed at the leadership (rather than people blaming themselves), power remains legitimized, acknowledged and secure with the leadership.

        The elite print the money, own/run the Fed & banking system, set interest rates, manipulate stock/forex markets, make laws, fund wars/revolutions/coups/assassinations/terrorism, traffic drugs, traffic sex slaves, own all major/international corporations & media outlets, own/run the World Bank & IMF, run the UN, have the leaders/presidents/dictators of powerful nations in their pocket, run our educational/judicial/legal/medical/agricultural/scientific institutions, suppress/hide advanced technologies & alternative health treatments, suppress/hide our true ancient history, cover up & distort alien/UFO evidence, and so have virtually unlimited resources at their disposal. So why the hell would they care if you call the President an asshole or who you vote for…or even if you take to the streets to protest/riot/occupy/march? However, you can indeed place your life/reputation/status/job/credibility in peril if you expose or threaten to expose certain information the elite don’t want exposed, or if you happen to gather a substantial level of influence without regard to “playing by the rules” of the game.

        <>

        No. I wouldn't say "any" system would work, because if ALL ACTED benevolently, only a benevolent system would be accepted…and so only a benevolent system would exist. On the other hand, if MOST people ACTED benevolently, yet they existed in a despotic/selfish system, then we must assume there is some form of mass conditioning/programming and fear (ie, enslavement). I’d say ALL are basically good/unselfish…but not all, for varying reasons, ACT or choose to EXPRESS themselves that way. The elite are extremely shrewd and have learned exquisitely well over the millennia how to both enhance and capitalize on our lower (animal/instinctual/survival) brain functions & behavior.

        If violence/war was really a driving & predominant behavioral trait in humans, it would be unnecessary for the ambitious & avaricious elite to continuously strive to divide us in order to conquer & subdue us. Our natural state is to live peaceably & cooperatively within our social groupings. Even the most "evil" people can harbor great love/caring for a person(s) or pet. Hence, even total anarchy is impossible among humans…for despite massive upheaval, we would naturally continue to congregate into groups for survival and social & psychological support. This would be the time when a certain FEW, displaying lower behavioral (but ambitious & avaricious) tendencies might begin to rear their ugly heads to assume a proto-kingship role by exploiting the MANY at their weakest time. Even the rare, well-meaning leader-to-be’s who may not strive for absolute power from day one, will likely succumb to corruption with growing influence, as well as interference from the already corrupt.

        To me, it’s plainly clear that humans are by nature benevolent, peace-loving, compassionate, social, friendly, generous, and cooperative…and that UNprovoked violence & war against others is not our natural state. Yet, the potential for such extreme behavior exists because fear & emotional agitation can at times become overwhelming factors. It is the MAJORITY that is peace-loving & sociable, while it is always the MINORITY (avaricious & ambitious elite/few) that seeks & promotes violence and war. One would wonder then, how do such a FEW ever achieve such a level of power & influence over the MANY? Well, if one looks carefully, one will see that it is these FEW that seem to display a high degree of a combination of charisma, ambition, shrewdness, boldness, avarice, aggressiveness, and coldness of heart...plus, an ability in articulating & manipulating words, and a calm adeptness to lie & deceive. Essentially, we’re talking about smart monkeys. These traits are what it takes for the FEW to derail the MANY away from their healthy, balanced state of mind. And the results are plainly evident: Good people are made to invade other nations, kill innocent people, become emotionally blinded by patriotism & empty pride, assassinate people they don't know, blindly follow orders, design/manufacture/sell deadly weapons & destructive/toxic products, and encourage & teach their children to do the same…and so on.

        Indeed, our natural tendency is to live and work together peacefully, though the elite would have us believe otherwise --- that the individual cannot be trusted, and propose that the only “solution” is for each to forfeit their individual sovereignty for and to "the group".

        <>

        You’re speaking of people who still have yet to learn & accept complete cooperation, have yet to learn trust coupled with discernment, and have yet to understand that complete cooperation offer FAR GREATER rewards for everyone than ANY monetary system could ever hope to offer. If everything is free there’s no need to keep score. Whatever you need will be freely available (and abundant) without the need to hoard or protect it from others.

        By marrying imagination and logic, a simple means of ensuring that people earn what they receive would be to require the person who desires Product X to have to help manufacture Product X SOMEWHERE along its line of development…eg, design, assembly, processing, inspection, repair, construction, mining, growing, harvesting, etc. (This would be outside of, or in addition to one’s primary work of interest if desired.) There is no need for one person to build a product from scratch…but only to help in its manufacture. They will then not only earn the product, but also gain knowledge, insight, and an appreciation for how it is produced. Further, we’d be more apt to do our own maintenance & repairs…and to contribute to its improvement. And importantly, such a method would also ensure that only products that are needed at the time will be produced, thus eliminating mass production, waste, and work boredom.

        In our societies people mostly acquire goods by simply handing over some cash, so that not an ounce of effort did that person expend in producing said goods. So even a hamburger flipper can acquire (mostly on debt) a car, a domicile, a large TV, video games, various household gadgetry, food, clothing, and so on (at least in the Western world), and all without directly contributing anything that is essential. Likely also, the hamburger flipper will marry, have children, and be raising a new generation of parasites (just as the elite designed it). As long as you can acquire money, however way you do it, you can live off the labor of others. This is not only seriously wasteful, but it makes MOST of us (not just the wealthy/elite) no better than parasites. And I am not exempt from this classification either, though that will change when I become a farmer. I would say those that teach, farm, labor in factories, work in building & construction, repair/maintain/operate machinery, design & develop technologies, and treat the sick are exempt.

        <>

        This sounds similar to what I just said. It would be most logical to have the recipients of goods/services to earn it by DIRECTLY helping to take part in its manifestation…which, if I am understanding your words correctly, is what you are saying too. I would only further that by having ALL people do this…not just the money-less (assuming we’re still using money).

        <>

        Why would “wealth storage” be necessary in a money-less society? As a wheat farmer there’s no need to store wealth because you will only produce what is essential for you & your local community…not for export (which places a great burden on local resources), not for money (because everything you want/need is free). Plus, in a money-less, fully cooperative society you will be farming because that was your chosen field of interest (or one of them), others who desire some of your wheat after harvest will be available to help him grow/process/harvest the wheat, you will have the best technologies available to reduce your farming work-load, local & global populations will naturally decline (due to very high standards of living) so fewer people that need/want wheat, and no need to pay for farm equipment/workers/insurance/medical costs/housing/land lease/debts/utilities/transportation/communications/etc. Fewer people will need/want your wheat also because in a money-less society people can have their own small home gardens, medium-sized local community gardens, and larger city gardens, and also wild land/sea game & plant foods. The variety of food would be quite substantial, abundant, and with a high nutritional profile.

        By the way, I used to live in Austin. Loved it and miss it.

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        • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

          IJEEsus, LAWD, have MERCY! (which he never really was in the habit of doing for humans, LOL!) Austin is worse than Houston which is heaven compared to the hell of Dallas! Make 'em all suburbs of each other and you got the worst of Chicago, 'fer cryin' out loud! Where do you live now that's so bad by comparison to THAT that you actually 'miss' Austin, LOL?

          But some interesting analysis there, on your part. This response will be addressing both you and EOA who are both on slightly different paths to the same place, with a bit of a reality check which I've realized far too late in life is a fundamental 'prepping 'requirement for any excursions through the mind wasteland of 'wishful thinking' without getting stuck in the morass of delusional respite. Which is the natural emotional default to cognitive dissonance and mental stress. Sort of like a grown up version of the fantasy escape trips we took when we were kids on the lifeboat 'Imagination' , but can no longer afford the luxury of the expensive ticket anymore, in the real world of the 'here and now.

          The 2nd Greatest Commandment was to understand that 'Nothing ever was, or is as it seems' in the human experiment.

          So to remove the obstacles of specious stones and thought bending potholes on the road to true enlightenment you have to start by 're-paving' it with proper essential material.

          You cannot, for instance, drive forward without potential problems if you have bad gas, faulty wiring , or oil leaks like even in your logic examples. Take EOA's and your 'Wheat
          Example' here in the discussion.

          Your are referencing an element of exemplary support in your point that is founded in one of the biggest commercial frauds ever perpetrated on consumers.!

          Wheat is promoted and marketed as a 'healthy' food when in reality it is the worst thing to eat because it spikes your glucose metabolism so high that it literally is one of the major causes of diabetes if you eat it regularly! Many honest nutritionists say it's worst than white bread. But since wheat is cheap and easy to produce and creates a good profit margin, they will do or say anything to sell it including the outright lie that it is a health food.

          But the so called health professionals don't mind if you have diabetes. Big Franken-Pharma makes monster profits off your poisoning with a mutually beneficial --$$$--'arrangement' with your health care providers. There's no 'money' in being healthy. But there certainly is 'great
          wealth storage',LOL! in keeping you sick!

          So, essentially, you and EOA are using a tainted and flawed reference example when constructing your logic. If you built a house using fraudulently passed lumber load codes, your roof would collapse after the first heavy dump of reality snowfall?

          I don't know if i'm articulating this well enough here but my point is that you can't have any lofty social change aspirations until you first clean up the shit-house world we currently dwell in. And that's not as easy as it sounds because nobody 'gets' yet the honest reality that almost every part of our current state of social evolution in terms of the elemental essentials of living and surviving in the collective consciousness was always directed by massive fraud and deceit. I mean we are like covered in it by layers of aluminum foil survival space blankets. How can we see anything clearly to make good, honest, reasonably objective decisions and critical choices when we can't even see the reality of what's outside of our blanket of delusion?

          Can't do it. And you can't just blame 'Them'...who are 'against us'. Most of us, in full intentional awareness, acquiesce to 'Their' dominance and control of the 'horizontal and vertical' in our lives. In fact, far too many of us actually 'like it'! Like when our mommies used to coddle and cajole us, pet and hold us... so warmly while feeding us. And even smilingly changed our pissy diapers when we wee-weed on ourselves.

          Jason, my hound dog nose picks up the wafting scent of a certain underground 'philosophy' in your visions of Utopia comments. Did you, perhaps, ever read or come into contact with any of the old Mark Hamilton Society of Secrets writings? I say old, because while this Dynasty of pseudo-illuminati scam groups lasted a generation, like all frauds for profit, eventually their house of cards began to crumble after one of their cohorts, famous TV marketer and plagiarist Kevin Trudeou, bit the bullet in a major Ponzi scam and since he and MH were 'business buds' and sooner or later the Federal Court asset forfeiture lawyers would make the connection in their search for KT's hidden millions of hard earned 'worker dollars' they stole from preying and playing upon poor gullible souls, and MH & Co should be right there all together on the same cell block by now?

          But anyway, MH had a series of 'utopia' style books with solutions for the woes of society and humanity including some of the logic you cited above here? So I was just wondering if that was one of the sources of your comments? In my vast repository of all the world's secret knowledge i have most of his works somewhere...
          If you want i can locate them for you so you can view parts of what you are say that are literally on steroids, lol! But you can probably just search ebay and get copies for a couple bucks...

          But back to reality for my survival 'friends' here, While it's good to see creative thinking in our discussions concerning our species status with the doomsday clock just a couple minutes 'of' at last observation by the nuclear science people who maintain it, here is NOT my philosophical opinion. Because 'opinion's are just speculations and they are nothing more than a knock off of anal orifices. Everybody has one, and you know what they are all full of?

          But the reality truth is out there. It's just not available to all of us yet because of our 'normalcy bias'.

          So for EOA as well as you Jason, here are some reactions to your 'money' and human value issues for 'Yall' (as they say in TX) to ruminate upon.

          1. Money. Unless you are cursed because you have so much of it that you 'worry' about what you're going to do with it, i would quote the stand-by Mob retort to all such mental stress situations: 'FAAAgetabout it'

          Because in a vastly diverse culture saturated with imperfect individual emotional content contaminated by greed and narcissism you will always have a 'need' for some form of 'money/currency' that can facilitate the satisfaction of the human appetite.

          All your suggestive social engineering solutions are meaningless in the pandemic social reality.

          Until the Essence of human nature can first be 'changed', on an Each and Individual level, nothing else in society will change. It will be 'business as usual' until the natural fate of human social entropy steps in for some minor, but species altering evolutions.

          So 'money' in some form or another--and hopefully NOT what i see coming in on the horizon-- will always be a 'medium' of trade in the world of commerce and business involving the necessities of human living, as long as the current social paradigm remains intact. Which is defined by the 'business' of 'Them against us', or the 'have's against the 'have-nots'.

          So i hope my message here of not putting the cart before the horse came through? Especially when 'They' own and control the horse.

          You can indulge in the futile exercise of 'planning' the re-creation of the world all you want but when you wake up from your dream you must go back to following the golden rule. 'He who has the gold, makes the rules.;

          The visionary Framers already manifested a 'utopian' social paradigm for us that wasn't a bad start toward higher social consciousness. Essentially the idea of their system was allow the majority of free thinking people to be emancipated from a situation where they could not control their own social destiny. Yes, yes, this interesting premise was since corrupted and compromised by flawed humanity.
          But we still have, By Supreme Law of the Land, the right and opportunity to 'preserve' a free state of egalitarian liberty and justice that still 'Allows' us to make necessary changes if we all agree? If we really 'want to do it. And that's the insidiouis little 'control' caveat that undermines the reality.

          Imagine how bad it would be in the 'Them against us' situation if we didn't have absolute right to fire 'Them' with our votes, anytime we wanted to?

          So obvious conclusion to any and all debates, regardless of their potential merit, is to first make certain we don't become too distracted in fantasy, and lose track or focus on preserving our basic rights of liberty. This is what they want us to do because while we're not looking, 'They' will continue their nefarious control agenda...which is to eventually preclude our use of this inconceivably precious Constitutional ability.

          And to sew this 'thread' back into the original theme cloth of 'survival' in this internal and social human conflict, in the foreseeable future it would be prudent Not to succumb to yet another fraud of 'buying gold as a 'hedge' against SHTF end times scenarios.

          Unless you have ALL your long term survival necessities in place, well secured, and formatted into a good plan, then quite simply, you would be stupid to be buying gold or silver.

          Think of it like this. Everything of 'worth' is anything of 'use' to the maintenance of human life. Much of this, especially in the social device known as commerce is known as 'commodity'. which is a specific form of a necessary thing we all need to survive and live.

          Most people use the same commodities. Say you have 'money', which most likely was a 'trade' for labor. and it's in the currency form of dollars. tangible dollars in hand are not in pure physical reference very useful except maybe in a paper use context. But they represent a universally accepted agreement to 'represent' value in commensurate exchange for basic necessary commodity value.

          That's it! If you get that, you got it ...down, baby.

          In a universal social breakdown, this dollar value 'agreement' also breaks down. But the 'commodities' like food, fuel, medicine, security, etc. are Still tangible necessities absolutely required for human existence, so they still have important universally accepted Value, (or stored wealth, as EOA might put it).

          So why would you buy 'gold' now, when nobody will 'want' your gold because it won't fuel their cars or heat their houses and they can't EAT it when foodstuffs becomes difficult or impossible to commercially obtain in the previous norm we were accustomed to in another life?

          So if one really really really spends sleepless nights dreading the inevitable TEOTWAWKI scenarios, and you don't trust 'money', especially the dollar, then wouldn't it be much 'holier than thou' to simply take any extra money you might have and instead of buying gold and certainly instead of letting a bankster 'hold it for you', take it and buy food, gas, or whatever... to stock NOW? Instead of trying to 'buy' it later when money 'just ain't worth the paper it's printed on and gold just ain't worth the weight to carry it.?

          I mean, you would be wasting it. You'd be 'spending' it anyway on the 'future' food and gas and such? You're just 'buying' it in advance. Part of your entire integration with 'money' involves consistent lifelong commodity exchange.

          So isn't it much much much better to have the actual HARD commodity on hand, as 'wealth storage' in place of fragile tenuous 'money'? It all turne into the same thing one way or another sooner or later? Just rations of value change according to situations. Hope that gives a better foundation of the merits, or absence thereof, of money in real time applications and use.

          OOP! as much as i hate to go, i must leave shortly to continue my 'mission' in life and head out for University 'Screwal' and 'learn 'dem headsfull of mush' a 'thang or three' about life!

          Y'all have a smiley faced day!

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          • Thank you, Mahatma...but I'm well aware of the health issues of modern, over-processed wheat (as opposed to the ancient, heirloom & properly prepared varieties like Einkorn, Emmer, etc.). I was merely using EOA's example...not endorsing wheat itself.

            Yes, grains, particularly wheat, are foods we don't require for optimal health...and for this reason must be carefully prepared using ancient traditional methods. Gluten is not the only potential issue, but also the various problematic proteins in the wheat germ itself. I don't eat wheat, spelt, rye, oats, or barley...nor even corn or dairy. I do eat teff, sorghum, buckwheat, amaranth, quinoa, chia, and kaniwa...but most of these are seeds, not grains. I also eat white rice (arborio, jasmine, and basmati), which is very benign & healthy...but not brown rice. One must be careful with arsenic levels though and choose the brand of rice wisely. I soak all these for many hours prior to cooking.

            All would do well to remove grains (or at least wheat), cow dairy, sugar (not fruits or raw honey), and GMO foods from their diet.

            In an ideal world, we would have a much smaller population and subsist mostly on abundant, pristine local wild game/sea food/veggies/fruits/mushrooms/nuts/roots/etc...greatly reducing the need for agriculture except to produce foods one desires that cannot be found in the wild.

            I will respond to the rest of your lengthy comments later when I have more time. In the meantime, I will leave you with this. It's an excerpt from the script of the 1935 movie, Mutiny on the Bounty, where Roger Byam (RB) explains the concept of money to Tahiti’s Chief Hitihiti (H).

            RB: By the way, what's your word for money?
            H: Money? What is money?
            RB: All right, l'll explain. Now, which would you choose? The shilling or the nail?
            (Hitihiti points to the nail.)
            RB: Oh, no, Hitihiti. With one of these (shows money) you can buy 10 of these (shows nail).
            H: Oh? Where?
            RB: Well, in England. You see, in England, you must have money to live with to buy food.
            H: ln island of England, no fruit on tree? No fish in the sea?
            RB: Oh, yes. Plenty.
            H: No money, no food?
            RB: That's right.
            H: l stay here.

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          • You said: "But anyway, MH had a series of 'utopia' style books with solutions for the woes of society and humanity including some of the logic you cited above here? So I was just wondering if that was one of the sources of your comments?"

            No. I have not read a single book of philosophy, ideological manuscripts, or religious texts. All that I said is based on simple logic. One need not have to follow or fill one's mind with the ideas of others...but only trust in the adherence to strict LOGIC. Logic will never fail you. If we do so...if we can relinquish our personal biases & opinions, if we can keep in mind the needs of both humans and ALL life forms, and if we can keep the BIG picture in view, then we will naturally come to the same conclusions. Logic is not debatable.

            Let me test your sense of logic with a simple issue we have today. What would be the most logical & simplist means of completely eliminating traffic congestion in metropolitan cities? Your solution must not only be logical & simple, but must also not hamper the ability of people to move around the city with ease.

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          • You said: " This response will be addressing both you and EOA who are both on slightly different paths to the same place, with a bit of a reality check which I've realized far too late in life is a fundamental 'prepping 'requirement for any excursions through the mind wasteland of 'wishful thinking' without getting stuck in the morass of delusional respite. Which is the natural emotional default to cognitive dissonance and mental stress. Sort of like a grown up version of the fantasy escape trips we took when we were kids on the lifeboat 'Imagination' , but can no longer afford the luxury of the expensive ticket anymore, in the real world of the 'here and now."

            Why this grandiose diatribe when you're just saying, "I think you're nuts!" You have a gift for gab, but your words/ideas are better suited for those unimaginative drones who have found comfort in their enslavement. They do not address or offer effective, permanent, logical solutions. Keep in in mind that playing by the rules of the game, no matter how "revolutionary" you think an idea may be, is NO solution.

            The only solution is to ELIMINATE the game.

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        • eastofaustin says:

          WOW! That's about all I can say. I think we are speaking a different language.

          On a single point: Why would someone want to store wealth? Because there is no guarantee that next year will be productive. To use "the wheat farmer", he may fall and brake a leg or it might hail and take out his crop, or their might be a drought or a fire or locust. Unless there are reserves built into a system, all are at risk, or are living at a subsistence level.

          My grandfather was a share cropper--quite literally. He children were not. That's one of the benefits of capitalism.

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          • EOA,

            What if the wheat farmer was killed, was permanently disabled, was jailed, became too old to work but didn't have enough to pay workers, or his crops failed to thrive each year due to disease or industrial contamination (like fracking, etc.), and so on? Just how long do you think the farmer's savings would last...especially if he has to pay for medical bills? Or what if companies like Monsanto decide to sue the farmer for "stealing" their patented seeds/genetic material just because their GM pollen happened to contaminate the farmer's field? Or what if the government or some wealthy developer/corporation decided they wanted the farmer's land and strong-armed him to sell? (The latter issues are typical of money systems due to corruption.)

            With cooperation (no money & no governing body), there's no issues with either having to save wealth or with dealing with corruption. If the farmer cannot work the field or cannot obtain a desired crop yield, he can still obtain all his basic needs indefinitely (and for free). For work, he can (when able) pursue other similar lines of work, or a completely different line of work that interests him. Everyone can do something. With cooperation, all would have access to learning, advanced tools & technologies, and any line of work one chooses. With cooperation, we can finally focus on our creative interests, rather than being pawns to a slave system.

            You may think I'm being unrealistic or even nutty...but these words will come back to haunt you if/when you or a loved one encounters a financial issue/crisis. Believe me...you will wish money did NOT exist.

            I've shown how easily & harmoniously we can all live without money or a governing body, and yet retain our modern conveniences...as well as ensure that we and ALL other life forms would thrive. It's up to each of you how we decide to get there. If we choose to live in large groups...then anything other than complete cooperation will, in time, corrupt & fail because our true nature is to be sovereign individuals & free to fulfill our full potential by pursuing our imaginative, creative & spiritual interests.

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          • eastofaustin says:

            Jason, I wish I had been shown how your system would work. I have been told (by you) that it will work. Oh, that it were true. All of my experience says not only will it not work, but it never has worked. Only at the end of the 2nd Chapter of Acts is such a system suggested and by the 5th chapter, people are lying to each other and the system has broken down. Marx suggested it. Lenin and Stalin turned it into gulags and a living hell. Your system sound like it calls for unselfish, sinless humans. Do you know where you might find a world full?

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  11. special forces says:

    IM NOT WORRIED ABOUT 2 PARTY POLITICS , IM WORRIED ABOUT PEOPLE LIKE JIM, WHO ACTUALLY THINK THAT RAISEING TAXES IS GOING TO HELP . DOES HE THINK THAT THIS GOVERMENT IS GOING TO PUT IT TO GOOD USE , ITS GONNA GO TO 5 MILLION ILLEGALS , THE GOVERMENT SHOULD BE HELPING THE HOMELESS VETERANS , THE PEOPLE IN AMERICA, OUR GOVERMENT SHOULD NOT BE GIVEING THE PEOPL WHO ARE ILLEGALLY HEREEVERY THING FOR FREE . I MISSPLACED MY LICENCE 1 MONTH AGO I HAD TO GO GET ANOTHER ONE , IT COST ME 31.00 DOLLARS . DO I GET ANY THING FOR FREE --NO -- JIM YOU AND M MORRON AKA M MOORE AND THE REST OF THE HOLLYWOOD ELITE WHO FOLLOW THOSE VERY BAD PRINCIPLES SHOULD PACK YOUR BAGS AND AND GO LIVE WHERE THE TERRORIST ARE , AND PLEASE DONT COME TO FLORIDA TO LIVE OR VACATION , I DONT WANT THE AIR OR THE WATERS TO GET POLLUTED , IF YOU DO HAVE THE BALLS TO TELL ME WHERE YOU ARE IF YOU COME HERE , YOU BRING YOUR GUNS AND ILL LOAD MY GUNS ,

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    • eastofaustin says:

      I would be totally against raising taxes if there were no way to control government spending. They only way I see is to make people in office personally liable for abusing government resources and/or civil liberties.

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    • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

      Hey SF, Not much gets by dudes like you, lol! That's all it's EVER been about is bribing value killing parasites for their votes! I can't understand what's so hard about 'immigration reform'? It doesn't have to be 'reformed'. Just put it back to like the way it used to be when they had to first be 'vetted' at Ellis Island? AFTER you REALLY put the 'hurt' on any and all illegal border excursions.

      I'm a 'wounded warrior' also who feels thankful i was lucky enough that i don't need a wheel chair or prosthesis like my other poor Bro's do and i donate money and time to help these guys and gals with their PTSD issues.

      If you need any back up there in FLA just let me know. I'll bring my 'shit' and hit it down and we'll plan an op. 'They'll' never know what hit 'em.

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    • Forget about raising taxes on the working class!
      The fairest alternative would be to allow the working class the same income tax deductions that are afforded to corporations. After all, The Supreme Court recently ruled that corporations are people. Therefore, under the premise of equal treatment under the law, shouldn't all the people be afforded these deductions?
      As for caring for our veterans; volunteer donations (most of which come from the working class) wouldn't be necessary if their care and expenses were provided from the vast corporate profits acquired from these wars.

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    • I agree with you, except for your statement about "2 PARTY POLITICS".
      There is no such thing in this country anymore.
      Think about it. If the minority party had enough power to shut down the government, then surely, as the majority party (which is now), they have the power to make things right.
      Why the inaction? Is it because they condone the "New World Order" and the ultimate enslavement of the population by a corporate government??
      Our forefathers fought a revolution against these same ideals that are being put into place now. The rich and powerful, like the king of England, do not listen to the voice of reason. History has shown us the way to make them take notice.

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  12. special forces says:

    whats up with this Jason , he says don't blame obummer are you serious who do want to blame , mickey mouse , you and the politicians *** , we will start blaming the Disney characters , enough breath spent on you go live.

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    • Special Forces,

      Let me ask you this. Do you believe you're capable of thinking logically and making your own decisions? If yes, then why do you look to the President, state & local politicians/officials, or other leadership and/or organizations to make decisions for you...and for which you seem to think you can make for yourself?

      Why do you hand over the authority of decision-making to others (by voting/petitioning/griping/protesting/etc.) when you know well and good that they have ZERO interest in your health & well-being? These are snakes pure and simple...NOT people you can count on, nor can you reason with them. So don't even try.

      The elite & their subservient minions only understand power, force, wealth, status, privilege, and hierarchy. The tools of their trade are anything that causes fear & suffering, and keeps us weak & dumbed down --- lies, deception, staged false flag operations, media/entertainment programming, taxes, bills, debt, inflation & rising cost of living, illness, germs, "terrorists/mad men/shooters" & other fabricated "enemies", food shortages, environmental destruction, wars, stock market & forex swings, and so on --- and this is accomplished most cleverly by getting us to acceptance money & government (ruling classes)...and by doing so, we unwittingly accept our own enslavement.

      If you think you/we need to follow some "leader" for a happy, healthy life, then you yourself are no better than a slave and thus a prisoner to your own emotions. Use your emotions as a tool, not blindly as a directing force. Try to think clearly, carefully, and logically...but most importantly, try always to see the BIG picture. Running around with blinders on makes it much harder to alter one's path in life. Much of what we've been taught by "authorities" is worthless at best...and an outright lie at worst.

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      • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

        I agree to a large extent but there's some intrinsic issues with the theory behind your message. The main one being the flawed human psyche, and the human intransigence of their pre-programmed subconsciousness, and the subsequent aberration of the collective emotional content in reality integration.

        The resulting pervasive cognitive dissonance in general society creates a collective personality psychologically dependent upon 'dependency', which feeds itself in abject ignorance, denial, and ambivalence, from 'bones' thrown to them by the 'Power Elite' controllers-- as opposed to an enlightened existentialism of individual Free thinking personal autonomy, self efficacy, and value creation.

        Old Albert said "nothing happens until something moves'.

        Well, until something 'moves' to seriously 'change' the mentalities of the majority of people...nothing will happen to change the present situation, except perhaps for the imminent entropy factor.

        It's like the Seed Salesman visiting the farmer and discussing business and the dog laying nearby is moaning and groaning. 'Why is he crying like that", asks the salesman?

        "Oh, he's laying on a nail and he's in pain..."

        "Why doesn't he just get up and off of it, then?"

        "The Farmer shrugs and says..." I guess it just don't hurt 'ENOUGH' yet!"

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        • Well, it’s not so much a “theory” as it is simple logic…for ALL “problems” have simple solutions if we only dare to step outside ourselves to see the forest despite the trees.

          One need not over-analyze the “issue” with humans. Each of us requires nutritious food, clean water, adequate shelter, good health, and the freedom to be left at peace to explore our creative interests. If these basic needs cannot be met, then there’s no need to invite superfluous ideas or bandaid solutions that fail to address these needs because it won’t matter to those whose basic needs are not being met.

          That being said, before one proposes that the human psyche is "flawed”, one must take into account that humans have survival & social tendencies which can be exploited by those clever and ambitious enough to profit from it. The argument then, if one is speaking of intrinsic or genetically based psychological/behavioral “flaws”, becomes debatable and must be assessed on an individual level and not make blanket statements.

          Noting that human behavior, like most of the Animal (and Plant) Kingdom, are guided largely by desire/need…which leads to will…which leads to actions that are guided by that which is anticipated to lead to some form of pleasure or reward to satisfy (ie, remove) that desire/need & regain a sense of balance. So it’s basically a constant balancing game. Techniques that can program/reprogram said desires (via specific applications of fear & love, pain & pleasure, etc.) can be easily developed as a means to manipulate the masses according to one's will. Add to that our species' gregarious/social nature, and our need to belong or feel wanted/accepted by our peers makes the task of subjugating the masses that much easier. Thus the manipulator need only work to remove a person’s sense of individuality & sovereignty by rewarding conformity, and punishing non-conformity. As a part of this task, the manipulator/controller must drown out the truth by repeating a lie, ridiculing the truth/truthers, and dumbing down the population…all the while portraying the elites/liars as bastions of truth & high moral standards through its various mass media/propaganda channels. The lie will then become widely accepted and continue to expand…and, in time, absorbing and acculturating other groups. Success for the manipulator is achieved when the people themselves unwittingly become self-policing, which makes the task of the manipulator (State/dictator) that much easier. To make an alteration to the game would only require giving the group’s minion leader(s) an order. The group’s members would then follow suit like lemmings. And anyone who dares speak contrary to "the group" will be viewed as a clown, insane/nuts, a radical, not a “team player”, or a threat to the group's integrity & security. Once the individual views himself as "the group" rather than as a sovereign individual living/working with others (though some prefer & choose to live in isolation), the programming is complete.

          The problem of keeping this type of social manipulation & subjugation going is that the manipulator pays a high price for it in terms of self-imposed stress. Such an agenda imposes numerous complications, constant struggle & competition, paranoia & inability to trust (due to projection of ego), keeping one’s lies/stories in order, fear of being exposed, addiction to unfulfilling "pleasures/rewards", narcissistic attachments & delusional pride, inability to recognize or acknowledge unhealthy attachments, insatiable need to compete/win, and an extreme parasitic dependency on others for personal gain. The FEW (elite) must therefore always be several steps ahead of the MANY to keep the charade/game going.

          Cooperation, on the other hand, imposes none of these issues, as it does not promote parasitic, competitive behavior as the driving force of the community. Rather, the sharing of labor, goods, services, knowledge, and ideas remain the driving force. You may ask, so what’s the incentive for working without money? The answer is, MANY MANY…eg, stress-free survival, peace, security, abundance & huge variety of healthy foods, optimal health, pristine natural resources, enjoyable work, tons of time for creative/recreational pursuits, everything is free, no bills/debts/insurance/charges/payments/fees/fines/taxes, no laws/rules, no police, no wars, access to the most advanced technologies, no secrecy, no need to store/hoard stuff, no/extremely little crime, and so on. Now ask yourself, can a money/competitive system provide all this?

          You said, “Old Albert said ’nothing happens until something moves'. Well, until something 'moves' to seriously 'change' the mentalities of the majority of people...nothing will happen to change the present situation, except perhaps for the imminent entropy factor.”

          Firstly, human society is like a ship. It’s always moving…but at different speeds. But alas, the wrong people seem to always be occupying the helm. Nevertheless, the FEW/elites can declare whatever desire/goal/plan/vision they want, but it can only be made possible by the MANY. When the MANY realize this simple truth, there will be no need for violent revolution. A major shift can happen overnight by simply ignoring the FEW & no longer participating in “the matrix”…and that is most easily done by everyone agreeing to stay home for a few weeks or a month. (Taking to the streets will only provide a front/target for the State to violently assault & exploited as a propaganda piece.) Everyone can stay at home by easily and affordably stock up food & water for a month or two…enough time to ensure that the monetary/banking system, military, police, and corporations are shut down. With this shut-down, the elite will be powerless and have no offensive means to maintain control. This would be the first phase…to simply strip power from the elite. After that, we start fresh, but retain vital jobs while eliminating non-essential jobs (which are MANY). The jobless could then fill essential duties, which will result in a massive surplus of labor reserves. Couple this with machines doing much of the hard/laborious/tedious & dangerous work, plus the shift from wasteful mass production to essential production, and the reduction in population due to the increase in standards of living…our work-load & work-time will be substantially reduced.

          Secondly, nothing major needs to happen or “move” for individuals to achieve complete freedom from “the system”. Any INDIVIDUAL can simply discard with their savings/bank account & major possessions and escape to the woods, or wherever they fancy. No debts, no bills, no crime, no possessions to protect, and hopefully little or no pollution to deal with. Done! To hell with the rest of that insane society! Without modern comforts, life will certainly not be without some physical struggle, but it will be exceedingly simple and healthy both physically & mentally…and even better if you and a few others of like mind decide to do it together.

          With that made clear, we can say that most people (including me) would prefer not to simply escape to the woods alone or with a tiny group and live like primitives, but to start fresh on a global, or at least national, scale. (This does not mean we should interfere with or molest indigenous groups still living off the land.) The reason being that the larger the community, the greater the support & opportunities available to each person. There’s nothing wrong or “evil” about a modern, technologically advanced civilization. The problem arose when people were conditioned/programmed to believe that only by accepting a monetary system AND a governing body could we ever hope to “maintain order” or to live in harmony with one another. We need neither. What would work beautifully is complete cooperation, and perhaps a “council of wise elders” (who only teach, offer advice/wise council/mediation…but do not make laws/rules/mandates, and do not need to be followed or obeyed by anyone).

          I leave you with a couple simple quotes all would do well to ponder & keep in mind:

          “When I let go of who I am, I become what I might be.” ~Lau Tzu

          "The important thing is this: To be able at any moment to sacrifice what we are for what we could become." ~Charles du Bos

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  13. special forces says:

    guess what isis said today ---they are gonna cut obummers head off , best news ive heard all day , watch out m morron , ben aflek seth grouber , and the rest of the Hollywood who agree with those assholes , I just feel sorry for the women of Hollywood , who will probably get raped by a dozen terrorist before they get their heads cut off . and if they get obumma , his poor daughters will probably get the same as the Hollywood women , p.s. obumma you better start building the military back up , and those marines who salute him every time he gets off the helo ,who do there job so well , and he don't give a shit about them , I know I wont salute a *** .

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  14. MustangWriter says:

    I advocate the repeal of federal taxation. The solution is simple. Strip the federal budget down to its constitutionally mandated functions and close all departments that are not part of that mandate; Energy, Education, Health and Human Services, etc. Return power of these departments back to the states. Next, calculate how much the federal government needs to fulfill its mandated functions and send a bill to the governor of each state for it's share of that expense, based on the number of congressional districts in each state. Then let each state decide for itself how to pay its share. Now, instead of congressmen going to Washington to grab as much cash as they can for their constituent states, forcing federal spending through the roof, they will have to go to D.C. to finds ways to reduce their state's share of the federal bill...a whole new dynamic. The only way to accomplish it will be to reduce the federal budget overall. Pork would be illegal and woe to any congressman who proposes any new spending.

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    • eastofaustin says:

      What you seem to be advocating (which I support) is a repeal of the 16th amendment. That doesn't cover all taxes, but does include all direct taxes on citizens of a State.

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  15. special forces says:

    I DONT AGREE WITH YOU JASON , JUST LIKE I HAVE NEVER AGREED WITH OBUMMER , SO IF ALL I HAVE IS A VOTE ON THIS PLANET , IM GONNA TRY TO CHANGE THINGS WITH MY SINGLE VOTE , SO IF YOU THINK ALL THE POLETITIONS ARE DOING NOTHING LIKE YOU , SO YOU WONT VOTE , THIS IS PROBABLY HOW OBUMMER GOT ELECTED , SO MANY VOTERS SAT BACK AND SAID THE BLACK MAN CANT WIN , WELL ALL THEM NON VOTERS WERE WRONG . YOU SEE WHATS HAPPENING BY NOT USEING THE LITTLE POWER THAT WE HAVE .

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  16. eastofaustin says:

    Mahatma,

    Truly appreciate your mastery of sarcasm. Yes, it is (or was) Austin TX. Used to live an hour east, but I moved and just kept the handle.

    I agree with what some of what you say about supply and demand and relative values of different commodities.

    I think you underestimate the difficulties of a direct barter trade society. It is highly unlikely that the person who needs what you have, has what you need. Three way trades are manageable, but again you have to have the right three people with the right things to trade. You sound intelligent and well read. Have you read much in the area of economics and the theories of "money."

    EOA

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    • Mahatma Muhjesbude says:

      EOA, well, I know a prepper in Houston, he's trying to get the hell out of Dodge and move also. But no, i'm not intentionally underestimating the difficulty or problems associated with 'barter/trade' situations. Of course it never was an ideal system. And that's why 'money/currency' was developed as an easier way to do business.

      I've got a few books on the 'lost arts' of barter and trade in the absence of standardized money but don't have time to study them now so they'll just have to wait for 'the proper time', if that event should ever happen.

      I'm trying to figure out what your direct info-message is but i lost the thought track here so i'm not sure how to respond, but lets just throw out a few ideas and see if we come up with any good sense.

      First off, i'[m assuming that we got on Barter/trade analysis in reference to 'prepping/survival' mode? Specifically in association with a serious economic dollar collapse?

      If that's what we're talking about here then my first question would be what else are you going to do or use to 'get' the stuff' you need if you don't already stock it if cash is only good to wipe your butt and start campfires with?

      There was an internet 'move', maybe a couple years back of which the exact name escapes me at the moment but was being designed as an 'alternate currency' but was actually just a 'knock-off' of Barter/trade enhanced by using the web as the organizational medium of exchange? You get on a list, for instance of what you have to offer (value?), and someone else would 'exchange' something for what you were offering. It seemed to focus more on service/labor intensive 'values'. I'll fix your kitchen sing plumbing if you change the fanbelt on my car, and the like. and it got pretty extensive and seemed to get off to a jump. But in thinking about it again, that wouldn't work in an all out SHTF collapse because the internet would be 'virtually gone', at least for most people not in the now underground government. But on a small local level, labor value always is an important exchange asset. Maybe even containing the most 'worth' in terms of 'stored value'?

      Having said all that probably implies that in the social integration of commodity exchange there always was, is, and must continue to be some mode of less bulky, more widely/generally accepted as money, form of 'value exchange' vehicle that can conveniently be referenced and equated to the perceived 'worth' of the item of exchange. Otherwise, efficiency and progress of 'doing business' is greatly depressed?

      This might be what you mean by 'getting complicated'. Especially in 'third party' extension transactions as you said.

      But the reality is that if it gets down to barter/trade for common transactions which will only be a consideration in the above mentioned 'end of days' scenario and/or the total absence of currency 'worth', what else would you have then, other than barter/trade?

      Lets ponder that for a while if i'm guessing correctly and that's where you're going with this?

      While i may have an above average knowledge of economics compared to most, due to my parallel academic experience in historical epistemology science, I still wallow in rudimentary understanding of this most mysterious subject that is so powerfully integrated in our lives. In other words, the more i try to comprehend the nuances of advanced economics and theories of money and commerce, the more i find out how stupid i am, lol!

      There is the notion that only a handful of people on the whole planet truly 'understand' the essence of economics. I know just enough about it that something like that does not surprise me. Which means i don't know 'JACK'
      about money, but i am familiar with Jack's cousin 'BULL'.

      I do have a modicum of knowledge of 'trend forcasting/ think tank' conclusions due to some G-work research i sometimes do? And this integrates with the future of our economy in some rather ominous forecasts.

      So go ahead provide me with some edification on 'money theories' and I'll provide you with some interesting follow up?

      Would that be a 'barter/trade' of any equity, value, worth, or...
      ...'wealth', LOL!

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      • eastofaustin says:

        Where this started was my statement that we needed increased taxes for everyone coupled with an austerity program for government so that the national debt could be paid off, or at least have the nation move that direction. There are a whole host of voices trying to convince us that the ND doesn't matter/ that it should be viewed as a percentage of GDP and so we have not reason to worry/ that the government can print its way out of debt so that the debt is artificial. I believe these voices are very dangerous.

        We both agree that "money" is a fiction. Silver has a number of intrinsic values, including a role in water purification. Gold has been valued because it's malleable and conductive. The first makes it attractive to jewelers. It has some limited use in electronics. As "money" it has value only because the amounts of each are somewhat limited and generally requires a lot of work to get it into a pure form. But the bottom line is that precious metal and/or paper or shells, beads, or whatever is used as "money" is because people are willing to accept it with the expectation that others will accept it at a later time. "Money" is a portable means of storing value in either the short or long term. Right now, dollars are a pretty universal form of money, and to a large degree, they are not made out of paper. They are made out of electrons, faith, and a bit of voodoo. People don't think about that for which they pour out their lives. But then, they do think about it, and deficit spending hits them like a boulder when they think.

        There are economists who will quickly say that personal economics cannot be scaled up to be an accurate demonstration of macro economics. That may or may not be true. I just don't know. What I do know is that people can envision personal economics. Any who believe that can kite checks or credit cards indefinitely are crazy or con artists. There are few who have not been in credit card trouble at some point in their lives. It is so easy to try and pass payment for today's wants/needs off to some future time. Most clear thinking people see a day of reckoning when the piper must be paid. (There are exceptions. You can die with a big debt and leave your creditors to pay for it. You may hit the lottery and pay it all off. You can file bankruptcy and dodge the debt, but in most cases, that puts you on a forced austerity program.)

        Most everyone in our society has their "wealth" stored in dollars. That "wealth" may be in promised social security checks, earned pensions, CDs, insurance, etc. It may be a welfare check. Your "wealth/stored value" or promised "income" is most likely measured in U.S. dollars. And this is find as long as we have confidence that others will accept the dollar next week/month/year. The problem is when we lose this confidence.

        Probably the prime example of "money" losing its value is Germany in the 1920s. Lots of reasons for it, including the Versailles Treaty. The bottom line was that too much paper was chasing too few goods. Not many years ago the Zimbabwe dollar lost so much value that they were printing 50 billion dollar bills. I've held one in my hand. The Zimbabwe government would not accept their own "money" for tax payment. While it hasn't happened here yet, it has crept in that directions.

        When I was a kid, my father made about $5000/yr. My mother didn't work. There was a $600 per person personal exemption for income tax. I had three brothers. There was about a $1200 per year standard deduction per household. Therefore my folks paid income tax on about $800 per year plus 2% Social Security-- a total of about $250 dollars per year in taxes, leaving about 92% of earnings for the family. Funny thing-- in those days, we could live a middle class life-style with an owned home and two cars (and the government was running a surplus trying to pay off the WWII debt.) And money in the bank would pay about 5 % in interest.

        The reason I relate this is that sixty years later, it would be hard for a family of six to live a middle class existence on $50,000. The "dollar" has lost about 90% of its value over my lifetime. Some of us has watched it happen. (It's like boiling a frog by heating the water.) The faster the debt rises, the less confidence people will have in the dollar. It may be because they think, or it may be because they know that's something wrong when they go to the grocery store and discover that it takes $200 to fill a shopping basket-- something that I used to fill for $25 to $30.

        You are right that if the SHTF or we see TEOTWAWKI, we will be back to an age of direct barter and trade. Ammo may become the new "money" for a while. Who knows?

        After I say all this, the point that I'm trying to make is simple. If acceptable "money" disappears, it will make it very, very hard for our society to stabilize or rebuild. It is far easier to regain confidence in an existing medium of exchange than to create a new one. Stabilizing the dollar should be a top priority for everyone, and there is a cost to doing that. That cost should be shared.

        Okay, that's my point. I can add to it, and I will, for a moment. If we simply raise taxes and kill welfare, we will have starving, rioting people in the street. They will tear the nation into little pieces and we may never get it back. Therefore, the suggestions in my first post. It is necessary to create a path to the future for those on the margin. Yes, my program eliminates a lot of choices and freedoms for those who can't make it on there own. My program would force a particular set of values on those who sought assistance. My program would not be popular, until people had moved through it and become productive members of society. Those "graduates" would become the greatest proponents of what I suggest. (How many Marines or Seals want to make boot camp and initial training a piece of cake? Every one I know take great pride in not having taken the easy way.) My program CANNOT be put in place after the fall. It is only a possibility now, as a substitute for the welfare state in which we live. The libs will never back it because they gain control by bribing people with payouts. Unfortunately, they are undermining the dollar with deficit spending. Pay now, or pay in a much worse way later.

        Interested in your comments.

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  17. SPECIAL FORCES says:

    EOA YOU THINK THE PEOPLE WHO GET EVERY THING FOR FREE ARE GONNA GET OFF OF FREE RENT, WELLFARE , FREE MEDICAL , EVERY THING FOR FREE , I GO TO WALL-MART I HAVE A HARD TIME JUST BUYING HAMBURGER , WHILE THE BLACK LADY WITH 5 KIDS AND NO HUSBAND IN SIGHT AND 4 SHOPPING CARTS FILLED TO THE BRIM , WITH STEAK AND CRAB CLAWS IN ONE CART , IS GONNA GIVE THAT UP , MY TAXEX ARE PAYING FOR HER TO COLLECT 1,000 A MONTH FOR EACH KID , WHILE IM LIVEING ON 15,000 A YEAR AND SHE IS GETTING 8,000 THOUSAND A MONTH, ALL MOST 100.000 A YEAR PLUS EVERY THING FOR FREE . EOA YOU BETTER WAKE UP AND JOIN THE REAL WORLD , IM DRIVEING A 4 CYL CHEVY CAVERLIER THERE DRIVEING BRAND NEW SUV , EOA YOU JUST DONT MAKE ANY SENCE ,

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  18. SPECIAL FORCES says:

    EOA --- OH YEAH AND SHE WAS PREGNENT AGAIN , AND PAID WITH A WELLFARE CARD , HER BILL WAS 196 DOLLARS , AND SHE HAD THE BALLS TO ASK FOR CASH BACK . SHE ASKED FOR 60 DOLLARS IN CASH FOR GAS .I CANT GO ON TALKING TO PEOPLE LIKE YOU WHO WANT TO MAKE ME PAY MORE TAXES,

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  19. eastofaustin says:

    I don't support increasing taxes for the current system. I propose a new system that would never allow the situation you describe. If you are really SF, you have the skills to analyze a foreign culture and find the ways to enter it and change it. (That's the job of Special Forces--to imbed with foreign people and mold them into a force that supports us. That starts with analyzing a culture.) Generational poverty is a cycle that must be broken. We must transform tax takers to tax payers or we are all going down the tubes.

    If you are really living on $15K per year with no assistance, I commend you. However if this is the case (and you are single), you have over $6000 per year in standard deduction and about $4000 in personal deduction. That leaves your total tax bill (income tax) at 10% if $5000 or $500 per YEAR. A 10% increase in your taxes would be $4.20 per month.

    ONCE AGAIN, I am not advocating an increase in taxes to continue the present welfare system. I am advocating a responsible approach to save our money system and DESTROY the CURRENT WELFARE SYSTEM. SF troopers are some of the most intelligent folk in our nation. They know how to study and listen carefully and do critical thinking. AGAIN, I am open to change my mind if someone proposes a better way to reform the system. All I hear is "thumbs down" and negatives but no suggestion how to fix anything. For me, that is less than helpful.

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